sure we hope it is the latter. the markets had a great day up 150 points on the dow 1.2 percent, who would be happy than mr. neil cavuto, finally back. >>neil: what is it with cliffs. nothing changes. over the cliff. and, now, over-the-top. welcome, everyone, i thank my colleague and friends for doing such great work when i was out the last couple of weeks. it amazes me despite the news i

missed what i does not miss, two things, the fearmongerring and the driving us off the cliff thing n this add from the service workers union and liberal group called americans united for change, no change, republicans are recklessly risking default and driving the economy off the cliff. off the chart. what is it with the liberals and cliffs? remember the guy look, like paul ryan, pushing the granny looking a lot like the lake harvey korman off the cliff with medicare cuts over-the-top. i have been out a couple of weeks but it seems that many liberals are out to lunch refusing to see the policies as they are the ones driving this country off the cliff. now, it is not adjusting government spending that is pushing us over the edge, it is refusing to address that spending. we are all going over the cliff because we are all out of money and on the left, out of ideas,

as well. that is why it is crazy attacking anyone who has the guts to say it is time to change things because at risk of going out of control is alive and well, and we are speeding along this dangerous highway for decades and it is time we wake up. because when we raise the debt limit and ignore what got us into raising the debt limit, we have to hit our limit and me, i just hit the wall, take it from someone missing work, these guys are just a piece of work. and senator demint is being credit sized by many in his party for not accepting business as usual that he points out is a great person awakening, the best seller on this very subject. we tried to get someone from the f.b.i. here to respond so far, no response, but, hope springs eternal. senator, good to have you. first off, on the news of the day and whether we are closer to a deal.

what do you hear? >>guest: there is a bill that passed the house of representatives, the cut, cap and balance bill, that is very common sense, cut spending now, cap it over 10 years and try to move to a balanced budget and let the american people decide if we should balanced budget amendment and that bill will come to the senate this weekend, the democrats are threaten to filibuster but all we and for is debate and amendment the only bill here that has a chance to pass before the august 2nd deadline. the president has not given us a bill. the democrats in the senate have not. but i am very thankful for the leadership of john boehner and the house republicans. they passed a bill overwhelmingly and all republicans in the senate support it and we might have a majority because a few democrats are willing to let us proceed to debate but the president i believe is really panicking and the democrats, the liberals thick the americans are stupid and they can run the ads but the

only responsible party in washington right now is the republican party. we have given him the increase that he asked for, and standard & poors and moody's will recognize this as meeting their criteria so they will not downgrade our bonds, so republicans have done all we can. we only control the house of representatives. >>neil: you could argue it is possible to pass it to the senate when the vote comes up on saturday and everyone else says that isen likely but you are right you could. >>guest: we are not trying to pass it just asking for an open, public debate opt bill for a couple of days. >>neil: i understand but it looks hopeless so i ask, senator, whether you see any movement toward a deal that would be to your liking? >>guest: well, there is in deal. coburn said in our press conference for cut, cap, balance, the gang of six has no

chance, the mcconnell is going nowhere. and speaker barne said today that the cut, cap, and balance bill is the bill that we need to be amending, debating, and we need to talk about it, the only core bill we have. there is no other bill if the president wants to take us beyond august 2nd, he can dismiss the bill but they are getting calls that americans think, over 70's percent, we need to balance the budget. this is in line with where american wants us to be. >>neil: and you mention s&p who had a powwow with republicans today, and it was extended to republicans, period. who called for that meeting? >>guest: i'm not sure. paul ryan has been very involved with the numbers here.

and jim jordan and we have a lot of new leaders in the house of representatives and they are trying to do it the right way. the media is trying to dismiss it. but this is a responsible, well written bill, and they is compromised with the president by giving him the debt limit and all they are asking for, is reasonable cuts, similar to what moody's and s&p are asking us to do so this is not a partisan bill. >>neil: but it is weird whoever arranged the meeting with the s&p folks, what they will say is we risk financial armageddon if we default, and the aaa credit rating goes away, association obviously, i would assume it was meant to scare republican members who were there. >>guest: i don't think so. if you read the statements we have from moody and standard & poor it says if we raise the debt element without credible, significant long term deficit

reduction, they are going do lower our bond rating so they are not after us just raising the debt limit they know we have to do this. >>neil: all right. putting meat behind it. you have been a critic as you have written in your book, about this sort of facade. when we constantly raise the debt ceiling. we are in this jam because we keep doing this. you go back through administrations, democrat and republican, 17 or 18 times, through the reagan administration alone, to what end? the debt keeps piling up, regardless, and i wonder ... what we solve with a quick agreement? >>guest: we did not need to panic and make a bad agreement but set goals how much we will cut next year. how we will spend the next 10 years. let the american people decide about a balanced budget. i sound like a broken record and the president says we do not need a constitutional amendment

but history says we did. the debt limit is supposed to stop us from spending but this is the 10th time in 10 years we have raised it. association i think we are on the side of the american people, over 70 percent think we need to balance our budget. and, so, this is the time to do it. we cannot borrow another $1.5 or $2 trillion and expect good things to happen unless the world believes we get control of the debt. >>neil: if it doesn't happen, everything does not stop on august 2nd. i don't think they will stop taking taxes out of my paycheck, so, the money keeps coming in, right? what can be done do prioritize the money going out? >>guest: we are not going to default. and we will pay social security and medicare. we have those trust funds that can be convert dodd public debt if we need to to cash out that is not ideal. but we will make our social security and medicare.

>>neil: so when the president said two weeks ago the payments to social security and medicare payments, they hit on august 3rd, they are in jeopardy, you say that is hogwash? >>guest: that is hogwash. the only way they will not get paid is in the president decides not to pay them for political pups. the resources are there. this is in question in august some time some government contracts, some payments for things that the government is doing, could be delayed. standard and poor could call that a technical default but we will not default on our bonds and the debts we have as a nation. we have the tax money to do that. if the president wants to drag us through that to try to blame us for his bad economy, the republicans need to be prepared to take that fight to him. we put our best proposal on the table and they have put nothing and why know what else we can do but say if you don't like ours, give us a proposal.

>>neil: senator, we were off a lot on the stock market today, are they worried about default or something worse in the next ten days? if they were worried they have a continue any way of showing it. why do you think they are behaving the way they are? it doesn't matter? you think you will reach a last minute deal anyway? what? >>guest: well, they probably think we will reap a deal and we probably will. but they also know we are not going to default on our loans. maybe it is their optimistic about the cut, cap and balance plan. i don't. but the markets know we are not going to default. we will pay our bills. so, hopefully they will stay steady despite what the president does to try to create chaos in the markets. >>neil: your relations with mccon el since you reject the his deficit get out of the way agreement?

>>guest: well, i appreciate him trying to negotiate in good faith with the president and i warned the whole conference a couple of months ago and maybe i am cynical i thought the president was using the biden working group to burn up the clock they create a crisis and it itemed out i was right but i can't fall mcconnell or boehner but we were not elected in november to make it easier for the president to spend money and increase our debt. this is a time republicans have to take a stand. we put a plan on the table that solves the problem and if the president wants to reject it, he owes america his plan. >>neil: senatorring always a -- senator, always a pleasure. fast and furious on capitol hill as the deadline closes in so we will be live this weekend during a special session voting on the cap thing, and we have a special two hour "cost of freedom," at 10:00 a.m. eastern, way, way, too hot outside so why not just

day inside and watch us and your friends will wonder what you are missing and you will say "turn on fox." and capitol hill house rank and file republicans are meeting as we speak with officials from standard & poor's, and the senior produce we for the house is keeping track. chad, who organized this meeting? >>reporter: a republican freshman from new york outside the city put this together. people are from standard & poor's and they are acquainting everybody with what happens if the united states defaults. there is an efforts now, and republican leaders tell the rank and file exactly what will happen. it was very telling today, during john boehner's press conference, he said, look, if we default interest rates will spike. every interest rate in the country will go up. >>neil: does that noon they are -- mean they are trying to apply pressure? >>guest: that is part of it. they are saying to republicans,

look, if we don't cut a deal and we do default we pass the ryan budget, this could add another $1 trillion to the deficit. if you are a fiscal conservative this may not be what you want but there is a way to get at this and there was strategy going on. they are waiting for the senate to move the cut, cap and balance plan. no one is going do agree do a deal or say there is a deal until they move that through the senate. that is one reason they decided to senator the house of representatives home this weekend so they can talk to their constituents. yes they will hear from tea party people but one member said you will hear from people in the goesry store, and when he goes to the store after church, it adds an hour to the trip and they expect people to say, look, don't let us default. maybe they will have the conversations back by the cans of peas but that is part of the strategy. >>neil: you have a good feel on this, what do you think? >>guest: well, again, they are talking about the possible

proposal, john boehner said today, it is worth considering alternatives. they not go for tax cuts, rather, tax increases in the house of representatives. there is a plan supposedly floating around right new to cut $3 trillion over a decade and at the end of the day that could be the only deal but you have to remember, can you not change the rules of physics, the rules of congressional physics mean 51 votes in the senate and 217 votes in the house of representatives. >>neil: thank you, buddy. big money guys are begs these gives to get in. what does that say? will it be lights out when we plug in? ly.

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>>neil: an only podium in the house of representatives and the s&p, the credit rating agency that missed the financial meltdown a few years back, but

that is just details, members of the s&p are meeting with at first what was to be republican members of the house of representatives but now citizenned to all republicans and i don't if that includes the senate, probably not, but they are going over what happens if the event of default and what is at risk. many argue that happens annually if the debt ceiling is not raised and others disagree. and freshman congresswoman put this together and will be my special guest at 6:00 p.m. to detail what happened. i am worried you don't get fbn -- demand it. >> and people are begging perry and chris christie to jump into the race this week. my guest says that does not look good for the candidates in the race. and it is the old argument good from afar but when you are in, far from good. what do you make of this?

>>guest: you are right. when one of the guys jumps in to the race, then everyone will open fire on them, june lists will start running from files and highlight their negatives, so, that will bring them down to earth but what you are seeing is that there are great reservations in the republican establishment of the current set of candidates and this has been going on for months and months and months. >>neil: but what about 1992 among the democrats and bill clinton emerged. >>guest: yes, yes, back in 1992 george herbert walker bush locked formidable after the iraq war, the first iraq war, and, so, the big democrats, such as cuomo, they were staying out of the race and that left it to small fry like bill clinton, no one heard of him, governor of arkansas, and he wasn't a national figure. and of course he turned out to be a stellar politician.

whatever you might thing of his presidency. >>neil: but romney is very well-known, the best then of the bunch. what does that mean? >>guest: the problem for romney is his positives are not as high as candidates normally would be if they were the front runner. back in 2000 when bush was the front runner, he had 63 percent approval from the republican primary voter. today, romney is down there at 40 or 45 percent or less and that does not look good for him. that is the problem. and the negatives are higher. bush had almost no negatives and romney has high negatives. >>neil: thank you very much. we have breaking news, always a pleasure to have you, though. great historian. president obama cleaned up with wall street in 2008 but someone else is running away with the cash right now.

and charlie on that at 6:00 p.m. and now we have to hitch a ride with the russians to space? something tells semi- that the astronauts, the next to last man to walk on the moon is not very happy but he is here. [ male announcer ] it's simple physics... a body at rest tends to stay at rest... while a body in motion tends to stay in motion.

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>> having fired the imagination of a generation, a ship like no other its place in history secured, the space shuttle pulls into port for the last time. >>neil: it is all over. no more launch. no more landing. no more final count down. after 30 years our space shuttle program is over. now, if americans want to go to the moon, they have to hitch a

ride. with the russians. and they have to pay $60 billion a seat for the privilege. and the russians are loving it declaring today the start of a new era, and former nasa astronaut the next for last man to walk on the moon, and, senator, this is weird. russia gloating on a day we go out of the space race. >>guest: year is one of many words that might be applied. certainly we can celebrate the remarkable technical and operational accomplishments of the shuttle program over 30 years. but at the same time we have to mourn the fact there is not a space policy today a national space policy that deserves that title. i hope the next president realizes the critical economic,

technological and geopolitical role a strong national space policy plays and well just have to wait-and-see. >>neil: this president's support of the space program has changed since john f. kennedy when people look back. a poll showed sentiment expressed at what voters think. who do you think has it right, 63 percent say president kennedy and 13 percent say president obama. >>guest: it reflects a very long support, long-term support for america's dominance in space by americans and by the voters. eisenhower and kennedy working together made sure that we, really, won the space race with the then soviet union.

it was part of the cold war gentleman i don't -- geopolitics and johnson and nixon determined do terminate and space policy has drifted since that time in spite of the remarkable accomplishments of the space shuttle. >>neil: do you fine it odd that everyone is in but us. the japanese. and the chinese. i was expecting to see luxembourg pock before pop up, everyone but us. we triumphed and now we are leaving it and hitching rides. >>guest: we left deep space back, really, in 1968. we started to leave the nearer space playing field when we did

not fund the george w. bush initiative properly so that schedules could be maintained with the program to provide a replacement for the space shuttle which, indeed, has been aging. it had more flights left in it, in question, but it was aging and would have to be retired and that was the plan in 1964. unfortunately, the white house under bush and the congress at that time, did not provide the funds necessary to ensure it met schedule and that gave probe the opportunity he would have taken anyway, but give him the opportunity to cancel the entire program. >>neil: you did not join in sinning on the moon, but added a word but you refused to sing on the moon and i wonder, why?

>>guest: well, i hate to ever correct anybody but i was the one singing on the moon and he added a word or two. >>neil: and he got the credit. he said differently. now i know. >>guest: i was walking on the moon something, and i had a habit of starting to sing whatever song somebody's comment reminded me of and gene contribute add word are two. >>neil: i will talk to that guy. a real pleasure, thank you. >>guest: it's a sad time for our space policy but we are working to improve it. in question. >>neil: thank you. you are one of a very small group. thank you, sir, good to have you. democrats demanding hike in the debt limit but it was not always that way. >> most americans know

increasing debt is the last thing we should be doing. mine was earned over the south pacific in 1943. vietnam, 1967. i got mine in iraq, 2003. u.s.a.a. autonsurance is often handed down from generation to generation, because it offers a superior level of protection and because u.s.a.a.'s commitment to serve the military, veterans, and their families is without equal. ben your lega. get an auto insurance quote. u.s.a.a. we know what it t means to serv.

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how can they explain they think it is fair to force our children and our grandchild and great grandchild to finance this debt through higher taxes? that is what it will have to be. >>neil: there was in need for hike back then. in fact, it was un-american then. but can't live without it then. >> failing to raise a debt cerealing is a problem for million whose do not receive social security checks and the troop whose did not get paid and it would cause the stock market to crash draining american savings and retirement funds. >>neil: so, it was not an issue back then, a big issue right now. and now republican senator, what do you make of that, senator? >>guest: and president obama when he was a senator said president president been said it was a

failure of leadership and now he is saying the sky will come falling down. it is irresponsible the amount of spending he should look in the mirror and he is the one would has doubled our national debt in five years and will triple it in ten years and we need to pass a cut and cap and balance the budget of the united states and put that in the constitution. it sounds like we have just moved that vote up. it was supposed to be saturday and now it is tomorrow. i am one of the original cosponsors of that legislation. and it is the only thing that has passed the house of representatives and we have it in the senate. >>neil: why has it been moved up tomorrow, senator? >>guest: i am not sure why harry reid decided to do that. it was for saturday and i don't if he has members who have lands for saturday and they don't want to be working and doing the people's business there he is claiming we have to work and pass things because the time is running short. i'm ready to vote. i debated yesterday and again

today. american people know our problem is not that we are taxed too little but we spend too much. and we are borrowing $4 billion a day. a lot of it from foreign countries specifically china. it is over $2 million a minute. we can't continue this way. there is no way you can stay strong and independent and a force in the world if you owe that kind of money to a foreign country who doesn't necessarily have our own best interest at heart. >>neil: there must be a strategy on harry reid's part. if you move it up, does it make it less likely to be passing and it dies on the vine and you are back do square one? >>guest: i was ready with my colleagues to continue to fight on the senate floor all the way through saturday to talk with the american people about the need to have this bill passed and get democrat dozen support

it and have people around the country call elected senators to say the house of representatives took the first step and now it is your turn to pass cut, cap and balanced and he may be concerned that people are calling and telling their members to vote and he maybe was afraid that the more time americans have to have their voices heard it could affect what he wants done. >>neil: i talked to your colleague earlier, senator demint, and asked him to comment on the markets up 152 points and i guess they are looking beyond this and say saying you will raise the debt ceiling, with the correspondenting cuts, what if it is just raising the debt ceiling but you did not get to the cuts. what happens? >>guest: that is the problem. it is not is much the debt ceiling but the debt. the debt. the debt is the threat. you look at italy last week in

two days the interest rate went up a full percent. if that happens here on a $14 trillion debt you are talking $140 billion a year $1.4 trillion over 10 years, that is a significant additional hurt to our economy. and when 9.2 percent unemployment, people looking for work, this is the worst time to try to raise taxes on anyone but this is where the president is fixated. he seems to want to raise taxes and i want do cut spending. >>neil: and if so many are getting waivers, you want to open it up if we have given thousands out you want everyone in the pool. >>guest: i went to the senate floor today and introduced legislation called the wave act and all americans could get the same waivers that so many union people have gotten, if you have friends in high places you can get out of the high expensive

mandates of the health care law, they have given out 3.2 million waivers, half of those to people who get their health insurance through union plans, the same people that went and lobbied for the health care law, but new they found out what is in it they are saying we cannot afford there and we don't want this so any american ought to apply to get a waiver and be granted a waiver and all they have to do is meet the criteria that union or businesses businesses have ds to say this will cost more in insurance premiums or cause my health care to suffer. >>neil: thank you, senator. to give you an update in washington, this was talk that a budget deal was imminent and they agreed to $3 trillion in cuts and the senator pointed out that is not the case. senator demint said those cuts are not enough. and obviously, this horse trading goes back and forth and through the weekend so we are

live with our "cost of freedom," at 10:00 a.m. eastern and it will be too hot to be outside so you may as well stay cool with us monitoring the political heat in washington. a big two hours monitoring what is going on. great the heat on capitol hill to the heat in dozens of states, you think the power grid is stressed out now wait until everyone plugs in. [ male announcer ] you never know when,

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notify lifelock and you won't pay a cent. order now and also get this document shredder to keep your personal documents out of the wrong hands. a $29 value, free! get the protection you need right now. call or go to lifelock.com to try lifelock risk free for a full 60 days. use promo code: norisk. plus get this document shredder, free! but only if you act right now. call now! lifelock service guarantee cannot be offered to residents of new york. >>neil: and this started when i was leaving in earning season during the quarter and microsoft we like to report on because they are a bell weather have better than expected numbers with income rising 30 percent and revenue from the office software upgrade increased. but revenue from the division that includes microsoft windows, the standard operating software, i am sounding like a geek, but i

am, that was disappointing. it is weighing on the stock market. microsoft beat these numbers earning close to $6 billion in the last quarter and revenues were strong, at 17.2 billion but they are focusing on the core product, the windows separating software, disa.ing and apple will take a chunk of that because they have a new software so apple could be a threat. people up and down the east coast are feeling the heat and wiping away the sweat, and now, dealing with this is our reporter. how does it look? >> it is hot. two thirds of the nation affected: 33 states. over 140 million people. they say that it is attributed

to a heat dome and 22 have died so far. it looks cool, but according to our thermometer it is 100 degrees. with the index that means it feels like 110. so, the extreme weather, how hot is it? hot enough to cause the road to buckle. that is because of the heat and the laws of physics. that is being reported in several states. and the heat in your home is not a good combination because when the temperature rises and the ground dries you can get cracks in the foundation and that is reported as a problem and this is putting a strain on the nation's power grid. records already broken in the midwest and power companies bracing for more. >> the heat building up and it will be really, really, intense. when this is more energy use, cables expand and there is all the heat and humidity really,

really cook lead dog burn outs and other problems. >> cooling centers are opened up in many of the affected areas and that is to help people escape the heat. the best add -- advice, stay need if you can, wear sunscreen, and high detroit. as you imagine, businesses also being affected because people are taking that advise and staying home so customers not in the restaurants or in the stores, and, also, livestock is affected. in iowa, over 1,000 cattle reported dead because of the heat. a business benefiting is water. stay hydrated if you have to go outside. >>neil: heather, thank you very much. more than 140 members trying to keep cool and the power grid is feeling the heat and that is what worries my next guest as the president pushes more plug in cars. mark, the more people plug in the more likely everyone's light could go out, right?

>>guest: president obama has a stated goal of a million electric cars by 2015 and that is meaning our power grid could handle it if the epa and governors were not, at the same time, declaring a war on coal fired power plantses which make up half of the electricity that you plug into. so, it is a situation where if we do get this million-plus electric cars people are saying it will have a significant impact particularly in the hot summer months when we are maxed out with air conditioning. >>neil: how much of an impact? how much? how realistic a threat is that? there is only so much the grid can do we saw this a few years ago on the east coast when the power grid failed and power through the country just want out, how likely is something like that. >>guest: well, it is getting

more likely because of a war on coal plants and it has affected mayor bloomberg and governor christie, with a war on coal, so, half of our electricity, so the more we cut back the more likely we will suffer brownouts in the u.k. the air of constant electricity is ending. but you can encourage people with the plug in electricity vehicles, plug in at night because there will be smart grids to try to shift it around but the problem we face it is only going do add to the wees as we restrict energy we will add more consumption. >>neil: thank you. arizona has new plans for immigration at the border. will it work?

.

>>neil: now you can chip in over the border fence in arizona with the against being built with private donations. republican state senator is the man behind this law. senator, that is an impressive figure but you need $50 million, right? >>guest: well, first, thank you for having me. yes, the website just launched yesterday and it is www.buildtheborderfence.com and we have 1,200 donors already. >>neil: who are? what is the largest donation? >>guest: as of yesterday $1,000. but i have not heard reports today. a lot of people with $5, $10 or $15. but the neat thing we have to do this because of federal

government not building the continues but anyone that goes online and donates receives a certificate from the state of arizona that thanks them for the donation and it is, i cannot tell you the outpouring of support we have had and i hope it continues. >>neil: people worry about keeping illegal immigrants out and it court down in san diego on the number of illegal apprehensions and we will show examples of that and that is what you are looking for? >>guest: right, we did the same thing in arizona where in yuma, we built a triple layer fence. and would you believe after the fence went up we had a 95 percent success rate in stopping illegals if that sector so we want to duplicate the same thing in tuesday senator in arizona the number one gate through of all illegal entry into the country, a nightmare, a mess, not just the illegal aliens but

we have 12 to 20 million illegals that are sucking the social services dry but the drug cartels, the significant violence, and, yes, the terrorist activity coming across the border. >>neil: good idea to get the ball rolling. we will see what happens. thank you, senator. you think of these guys selling lemon, maybe they ought to sell ... apples.

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the two trains and a bus rider. the "i'll sleep when it's done" academic. for 80 years, we've been inspired by you. and we've been honored to walk with you to help you get where you want to be ♪ because your moment is now. let nothing stand in your way. learn more at keller.edu. ♪ ♪ >> neil: so finally i'm reading about apple $76 million dilemma. did you hear of this? that's how much cash they've built up. $76 billion. it's piling up so much money so fast it doesn't know what to do with it. i an idea. why don't you just buy the united states government? i know, i know. $76 billion is just a couple of weeks' worth of finance

charges on the debt but i say the government is hardly in a position to say no, apple. think about it. we do worse than having couple like apple running government that is rot on the the core. i say replace the ipod guys for the iclod guys and do it now. for one thing, apple makes products that people like. washington does not. apple makes stuff for which people willingly pay more. washington turns out a lot, kind of crappy stuff. but they insist on taxing more. apple can get away charging top dollar because it's stuff that is not worth it. apple doesn't need 2,000 pages to explain a hot product, a pamphlet does it nicely. its latest operating software. you download it. washington stuff galore just trying it. apple delivers on the promises. washington promises and never delivers. apple spends its money making products people want to buy.

washington spend our money pushing problems we don't want to buy. apple is pushing stuff that makes green and sense. think how crazy it would be for a to run the government. compared to crack pots running things now. it would be music to all of our ears. apple, run our government. speaking of our government we shall're getting record right now of a meeting between the democratic leaders of the white house 30 minutes from now. because things are fast changing and so fast moving and indeed, our triple-a credit rating on the brink, this weekend. we decide we have to get off of here and be on this. the two-hour cost of freedom on the fast moving debt deals in and out of we're going to cover this every step of the way. 10:00 a.m. to noon eastern time. it add to that, an hour on fox business network we have the freshman congresswoman bringing in the s&p rating agency to talk to colleagues about whata